Danny: Even as a person who is blind, this program has opened my eyes to the capabilities of people who are blind. And I appreciate every day the work that our teams do to find new and innovative ways to create employment for people who are blind. And Mr. Congressman, Ms. Congressman, we are capable and we will get it done for our men and women in uniform.

Welcome to the Heard & Empowered podcast presented by National Industries for the Blind. You’re not just a listener here, you’re a catalyst for change. Whether you’re blind, visually impaired or an ally, this is your ultimate resource for building a fulfilling career and an enriching life. We’re on a mission to shift perceptions, open hearts and minds and unlock unparalleled job opportunities for the BVI community. Ready to be heard and empowered? Let’s welcome our host, Dr. Hoby Wedler.

Hoby: Happy Wednesday and welcome back to the Heard & Empowered podcast. I am so excited to be here today and to talk to a very distinguished guest who I’ll introduce in just a moment. But before I do so, I just want to thank you for getting our name out there, spreading the love wherever you can.

Please, if you haven’t already done so, give us a five-star review if you think we’re worthy of it. Please write a comment, one word will do, in your review so that it registers in the system. And if anyone in your life is either blind or visually impaired, or you just want to educate yourself on what opportunities are out there for blind and visually impaired folks, this is the place to come. You’ve come to the right studio to hang out.

Today on the show, I’m so excited to have Mr. Danny Kelly, who’s the president and CEO of IFB Solutions in Winston-Salem, North Carolina. Now, Danny’s special because he’s an amazing guy, that’s first and foremost. But we are actually recording this week’s episode live from the NIB 2024 Public Policy Forum, where we are going to be on the Hill and advocating for the amazing work that we do and all of our agencies do. And Danny’s the right guy to talk to about that. Danny, welcome to the show.

Danny: Thanks for having me.

Hoby: Very excited to have you. I want to get to know a little bit about you, the man behind the mission so to speak, before we jump into the meat and potatoes, so to speak, of Public Policy Week and your role in that. So, can you tell us a little bit about your background?

Danny: Sure, yeah. So, I grew up in Minnesota, the cold white north, before moving through the D.C. area and then down to North Carolina. Along the way, I got a college degree. Give a shout out to Gustavus Adolphus College in St. Peter, Minnesota.

Hoby: Fantastic.

Danny: And an MBA from George Mason University while I was working for the National Industries for the Blind up here in the D.C. area from 2001 to 2006, before starting my career down at IFB Solutions. If I didn’t mention it already, I have retinitis pigmentosa. I’m the third generation in my family with that eye condition. So, I basically have light perception left with my vision.

Hoby: And what an awesome thing that you have parents who have been blind as well. So, no excuses, and boy, the expectations are set high, right?

Danny: The expectations are high. You got it.

Hoby: And that’s what does it. We have to be challenged. We have to be pushed. And what good are low expectations? They don’t help us succeed.

Danny: That’s right. I mean, there’s no – I shouldn’t say no entitlement, but that’s really the focus with my family, right?

Hoby: Totally.

Danny: Is to be an individual who is going to fully be successful at what they want to do in their life. And they’re going to push as hard as I want to be pushed to try out new things and go for it.

Hoby: And did you tell me you have a blind son as well?

Danny: I do, yes. My son, 14, a freshman in high school, has the same inherited eye condition I have, of course. Yeah.

Hoby: Awesome. Well, now you can pay back what your parents gave you, right? No low expectations.

Danny: Hopefully, I can be as good a role model as my parents were for me.

Hoby: I’m sure you’re excellent.

Danny: Thank you.

Hoby: So, you’re currently working as CEO of IFB Solutions, but you also have another title, which is very appropriate for this week where we’re here on Capitol Hill talking about public policy. You want to share with us what that role is?

Danny: Sure. So, in January, so I’m new at this, right, from a leadership standpoint.

Hoby: Sure.

Danny: But I joined the National Association for the Employment of People Who Are Blind, or the NAEPB Board of Directors, as the Vice President of Public Policy.

Hoby: Incredible.

Danny: So, yeah, been doing this for 20 years up on Capitol Hill each and every year, but now in a leadership role here with the NAEPB.

Hoby: And what are some of the responsibilities that you have as Vice President of Public Policy?

Danny: Yeah, so we met in February as a leadership team and all the membership to design our priorities for the year. So, a large part of it is listening to our network of associated agencies and helping them define what our goals and strategies are for this year to protect and grow the AbilityOne® Program and employment for people who are blind for years to come. And that’s the essential message of this program.

Hoby: So, you’re really spearheading, you’re working with a whole committee effectively to spearhead what the public policy standpoints are going to be, both now and in years to come, to ultimately improve employment opportunities for those of us who are blind.

Danny: You got it. With our 50-some-odd producing agencies in the AbilityOne Program employing over 5,200 people who are blind, it’s critical to protect those jobs through this congressional program called the AbilityOne Program and find ways to generate more opportunities for people who are blind facing this unfortunate 70% unemployment rate.

Hoby: And how many people are you sort of leading as VP of Public Policy?

Danny: So, it’s a voluntary committee and anybody’s welcome in our network who are members to join. So, we have monthly calls with our team and upwards of 30 to 40 people join those calls.

Hoby: Maybe I’ll have to join.

Danny: Come on in, anybody’s welcome.

Hoby: All right, thank you for that. So, Danny, I want to take this to really specifically what we’re talking about this week, this upcoming week and what we’re advocating for this year on Capitol Hill. So can you walk me a little bit through that and then I’m sure I’m going to have a bunch of questions about it.

Danny: Sure. This year, it’s a very simple uncomplicated ask, which is we are asking for the Department of Defense, our largest customer, to procure 1% of their total purchases through the AbilityOne Program to drive employment for people who are blind. So, right now, we’re at about 0.55% or just a half a percent of DoD procurement.

Hoby: So, basically, half a percent of all their spending.

Danny: That’s right, is with the AbilityOne Program.

Hoby: Sure.

Danny: If we can double that to 1%, guess what that’s going to do for jobs in the US for people who are blind.

Hoby: Sounds like it’s going to double it.

Danny: I could hope, right?

Hoby: That’s it.

Danny: That would be the goal.

Hoby: That’s it, yeah. Now, walk me through how this ask and this goal sort of got started. If I’m not mistaken, DoD, the Department of Defense, sort of made a bit of a promise, but not a mandated promise, right, to try to reach the 1% goal?

Danny: Right. Well, this started back in 2017, right? The wheels of government move slow sometimes.

Hoby: Sure, that’s okay.

Danny: But we’ve been working on it. They started a panel called the 898 Panel through the National Defense Authorization Act of 2017, which was there to investigate ways to improve the AbilityOne Program. So, it was this cross-functional government panel. In over four reports over four years, one of the key recommendations from that panel was, “Hey, Congress, establish a 1% goal to drive contracting officers to use this program more and create jobs for that workforce that is unemployed.”

Hoby: Sure.

Danny: And it’s a recommendation, and you have to get it into a piece of legislation.

Hoby: Now, who was it, it was recommended by 898 to the Department of Defense?

Danny: That’s right, by the 898 Panel to Congress, actually, as well as to the different regulatory agencies that support our program. The AbilityOne Commission® was a part of this. The Department of Labor was a part of this. Department of Education and the Department of Defense. And they were all in agreement through these four reports that this would be a good goal to have happen. But the goal has to be done through Congress.

Hoby: Right. Did Congress make a recommendation, ultimately?

Danny: So, Congress’s job is to pass the laws that are brought in front of them. So, this is what we’re here to convince Congress that, “Hey, the Department of Defense agrees with this, and these other federal agencies through the 898 Panel agree with this. So, let’s go do it.”

Hoby: So, and this is just an interesting sort of aside, but Congress can actually make, without passing things into law, they can make recommendations.

Danny: Sure, there’s lots of different ways to have your congressional members’ voices heard. They can write letters requesting oversight hearings. They can put in what they call report language into bills to suggest, “Hey, I think you should look at doing this.” And they can pass laws through legislation that mandate or require what they’re asking for. And that’s honestly what we want to do.

Hoby: Absolutely.

Danny: Get the mandate out there. The same mandate that’s out there for many other socioeconomic programs that drive both revenue, economic development across the United States, as well as job growth. For our program specifically related to job growth, yes.

Hoby: Well, you look at a lot of these issues that politicians discuss on a daily basis and, there’s always two sides to it. There’s a good and a bad. What I think about this one is that it’s really only positive. I mean, all you’re doing is guaranteeing essentially more jobs for folks with disabilities, right?

Danny: I may be a little biased.

Hoby: I think I may be too.

Danny: But this is probably the best public-private partnership ever created by Congress in 86 years.

Hoby: I think so too.

Danny: Because our customers, the Department of Defense, whatever other federal agency it might be, have to buy stuff anyway to continue and do their mission-critical work. So why not buy from not-for-profit organizations that are employing people who are blind, reducing dependence of all these people on other federal assistance programs? So at virtually no cost to the government, they’re generating over 5,000 jobs for people who are blind.

Hoby: Because the prices in the AbilityOne Program that goods and services are sold for are very competitive.

Danny: They have to be fair market according to statute, right? This isn’t a monopoly with crazy we get to set our own pricing, right? Our pricing is regulated by a federal agency and overseen by a cross-functional panel. So they’ve determined these prices to be fair market.

Hoby: Now, what are we talking about just in terms of ballpark numbers? I hear, okay, we’re at 0.55% now, we want to go to 1%. What does that mean in a ballpark dollar amount?

Danny: Well, you know the Congress just at the end of March passed a budget for the Department of Defense that was almost $900 billion. So right now our program, the AbilityOne Program, is doing about $4 billion in business with the federal government. Not all of that is with DoD.

Hoby: Sure.

Danny: I’ll be directionally accurate in saying about $2.5 billion of that is with the Department of Defense.

Hoby: Sure.

Danny: So we’re talking about growing this program and the spend to $5 billion a year through the AbilityOne Program and the 400 nonprofits that support and employ people who are blind or have other severe disabilities.

Hoby: That’s incredible. Truly incredible. And by the way, the ask is just for the Department of Defense to put this into law, right?

Danny: That’s correct, yes.

Hoby: So other agencies will probably hear about it, of course, and follow suit. We’re not explicitly asking them.

Danny: That’s right. Not at this point.

Hoby: Right. That might be a future thing to say, “Hey, you know, who’s the next biggest client customer we have? Let’s see if they’ll go for a similar thing.”

Danny: Right, and the Office of Management and Budget through the past administration and still to this day is recommending a voluntary pledge from all these agencies, federal agencies to go after this anyway. So it’s time to codify it in law.

Hoby: I agree. I agree. When you go to the Hill this week and you’re sitting down with someone who has very little time, what are the key messages that you bring to their desk verbally?

Danny: Yeah, I think there’s a few.

Hoby: And of course it’s different for each person, but I’m curious to hear the very educated Danny Kelly approach.

Danny: Well, we try to tell stories just like anybody else on Capitol Hill. And I always bring one of our advocates with us, Shannon Satterfield, who you talked with a few weeks ago.

Hoby: Yes. People know Shannon, he was on April 24th.

Danny: Right. And so does a great job in finding people jobs in our Workforce Services Division and creating staffing opportunities. And so we like to bring that personal message to Congress that these are the constituents you are helping. These individuals are facing an extremely high unemployment rate and a workforce participation rate that says 7 out of 10 Americans who are blind are not working. And we need to put those people to work. And this is a way that you can do it, again, at virtually no cost to the taxpayer, right? Government has to buy products anyway, why not purchase those items from nonprofit agencies that are creating jobs for people who are blind?

Hoby: Absolutely right. Very important. And I think seeing someone walk into their office with a white cane or with a guide dog, they’re saying, okay, this is someone I’m going to remember. I’m a congressman or a congresswoman, I’m going to remember this person who came and talked to me.

Danny: That’s right. And it’s, you know, you’ve got to, like you said, you’ve got to find a way to break through the noise, right? They’re seeing somebody new with a new issue every 15 minutes, and so statistics don’t always tell the story.

Hoby: Right.

Danny: Now, I’m a guy who likes to talk in statistics and numbers, and I got them all locked in my head. But we need people who can be passionate too and tell this story and be memorable and give a reason for them to get up on the floor on Capitol Hill and say to their colleagues, we need to get this done this year. Because the other message I give is over the last 10 years, this program has lost a third of its jobs and over 100 nonprofits in the program are not producing in the program anymore because of the challenges.

Hoby: Why is that?

Danny: Well, there’s a myriad of challenges, I’m sure. But new items aren’t being added to the AbilityOne procurement list. And so this is why we need this law to pass. If we’re dependent on products that were added to the procurement list in the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, you know, nobody buys tractor feed paper anymore, right? They’re all about using iPads and all that kind of stuff. You know, we’ve gone from making a simple t-shirt to the most advanced cold weather gear for our soldiers that you can fathom.

And if we’re not working to modernize what we are producing and adding new types of contracts and services to the AbilityOne procurement list, this program is going to die a death by a thousand cuts. And this is a way, this 1% program that we’re putting in place is a way to drive contracting officers to give us a chance and try out this program.

Hoby: So would more items hit the procurement list if this was signed?

Danny: Absolutely, that would be a goal. You know, there’s 28,000 people in contracting at the Department of Defense. In their lifetime, if each contracting officer added one new thing to the procurement list, we’d be talking about a thousand new items being added to the list each and every year. Right now we’re doing 30, 40, right? It’s not complicated.

Hoby: 30 or 40,000 items?

Danny: 30 or 40 items a year being added to the procurement list.

Hoby: Got it. Yeah, got it.

Danny: With 28,000 contracting officers in their career, if we’re doing a thousand a year, right?

Hoby: There we go.

Danny: That’s all we’re talking about.

Hoby: Yeah, so it’s literally just asking –

Danny: Contracting officer, add one thing in your life to the AbilityOne procurement list.

Hoby: So we get 28,000 a year.

Danny: Yeah.

Hoby: Yeah. No, that’s, that’s incredible. And they have the full authority to do that.

Danny: And they’ll be interested in doing it if they’re goaled on it at 1%.

Hoby: Right. Now let’s say Congress meets and this passes, what’s the next step? So what bill would it go into?

Danny: So we’re asking it to be added as a provision to the National Defense Authorization Act in the fiscal 25. It’s a must pass bill. It’s been passed every year for the last 61 years. It’s a great vehicle, especially since it’s directed at the Department of Defense to add language related to the 1%.

Hoby: Sure. Sure. No, it makes a lot of sense. And getting it in the NDA is the perfect home for it.

Danny: Yeah.

Hoby: What do you think about mobilizing? So we come up here and we have a great day on the hill and we do a public policy forum and we have great conversations. What are your thoughts on trying to mobilize our agency employees and that sort of thing and really make just an even bigger push with an ask like this? Sometimes I just think about that because it’s such a fun, simple ask this year. What are your thoughts on that?

Danny: I think there will be a time for that. And this is a year-round process.

Hoby: Sure.

Danny: This is not let’s fly in once and hope we get it done and then the representatives and all of us go back to our day jobs and put out the flyers that we put out.

Hoby: Right.

Danny: This is a year-round activity. We started this in, really in February at the forum. We’ve been talking to our representatives and our senators on a weekly or every other week basis for the last two and a half months. And we’re going to keep doing that throughout the summer. And I do think there will come a time when this provision is in place and they start looking at it going between the House and the Senate, you know, a lot of steps. And we’ll absolutely be mobilizing our folks to be writing letters, our board members to be engaging with their representatives and all the rest.

Hoby: And how do you typically engage every week or two with your senators and representatives during the push just before the Public Policy Forum?

Danny: Yeah, for us this is a relationship activity, right? We may be not only asking for items from our representatives, but we also reach out because of the low vision services and programs that we provide. We are here as a resource in the community as a not-for-profit to help their constituents who are blind or low vision or aging adults facing vision loss, right? And so we’re engaging these offices to also be a resource and a help in the communities that they serve.

So there’s lots of reasons to get in touch with your congressional offices. And we’re attacking that from all sides.

Hoby: Right. Well, and the advantage, I mean, let’s face it, so much of what we talk about and what we need to think about is fiduciary and monetary, that if more constituents are paying taxes, or more people are paying taxes in their constituent, excuse me, the better off it’s going to be for them and the people of that area.

Danny: Yeah, absolutely. The more people they have living independently in their communities, the better it is. So whether somebody calls your offices and is looking for a job and you refer them over to us and we help them find employment or they’re just having trouble reading their newspaper or seeing the television, we can provide the right magnifying devices to help them live more independently another year in their home. You know, everybody wins, from the individual on up in the system.

Hoby: And from my conversation with Shannon, he was saying, you guys actually really take advantage as much as you can of the recess that men and women of Congress go on every August and try to bring your Congress representatives into IFB solutions.

Danny: Yeah, and it’s been a real pleasure. You know, we’ve had Senator Tillis’s office out in February.

Hoby: Did he come himself?

Danny: He was not able to be there, but his military liaison came down from Washington D.C. and we were one of his very few stops along the way. So it’s nice to bring in the experts, right, to come in. And you really can’t imagine this until you see it. Like we operate like any other large scale manufacturer does in the US, making this incredible military gear, cold weather gear, the advanced combat shirt, t-shirts, the mattresses that our Navy men and women are sleeping on, on the aircraft carriers, right?

So for them to see that and say, these people can be doing more, let’s get this law passed, is such a –

Hoby: It’s huge. It’s basically saying, look at this before your very eyes.

Danny: Yeah. You got it.

Hoby: Yeah. And one of the other points I think that is a really strong one to make is that, hey, even though we might not be able to serve in the active duty military as part of the armed forces, we can supply goods and services for them on a daily basis.

Danny: Yeah, I have so many people that are proud of that exact thing. And then we have a lot of veterans who are blind, who have lived both sides of that mission that work for us.

Hoby: No, it’s incredible. And looking at just the good that is done every day by folks who are producing these amazing products and services just, I think it creates a fairly obvious message to Congress that this is important.

Danny: Yeah. And the message is you’ve done great work by the passage of this program, so let’s take another leap and expand it and do more good.

Hoby: Absolutely. Anything else related to the 1% that we’ve been chatting about that you think would be good for our guests, our listeners to chat about and hear?

Danny: I think we’ve covered a lot of ground today.

Hoby: Yeah, I think it’s been really good. What are you most looking forward to about going to the Hill?

Danny: You know, I’ve been doing this for almost two decades, either with NIB or after, since at IFB Solutions, going up on Capitol Hill. It is still an incredible honor and pleasure to be able to walk into the halls of Congress at the highest levels of government in the United States that oversees, you know, 330 million Americans and meet with your elected leaders. That is just an incredible democratic experience that I’m glad school groups have it and do it, but the more people that do it, the better.

So it still blows me away every time that we’re able to interface so well with the leaders of this country.

Hoby: And in whatever part you can, you’re making a difference.

Danny: You got it.

Hoby: Absolutely. So you have, I know, a board meeting here at this conference, actually later this afternoon.

Danny: We do, yeah.

Hoby: Yeah, what are you going to be discussing? I imagine your part of it as VP of Public Policy is a fairly substantial part. What are you guys going to be discussing?

Danny: So for me, this is it this year, the 1% goal. This is our focus. It’s a burn the boat strategy, right? We’re going in where we’re going to make this happen. We’re not going to diverge from this strategy and this focus.

So we’ll be talking about what we’ve done and not only what we’re going to do this week, but what happens next week, right? That’s the important thing. Everybody goes back to their fires, back at the office. And we’ve got to keep the attention on this of both our NPA agencies and Congress. So not only what are we doing this week, but what are we doing next week to drive this message forward?

Hoby: Love it. I’m going to ask you a couple of questions that I like to pose to folks at the end of the podcast. They’re always a little bit different, but I think I’ve got a good couple for you.

Danny: Awesome.

Hoby: What would you tell a Congressman whose office you were sitting in who questioned the capabilities of blind people? You know, if you didn’t get a chance to take that man or woman to your agency to show them before their eyes, they said, oh, blind people are going to have a hard time producing all the goods and services that we need. How does that work? What would you tell them?

Danny: So can I make this a little long story?

Hoby: Yeah, make it as long as you want.

Danny: So I started out my career in the recruiting and placement business, and I was helping people who were sighted get jobs in the Minneapolis, St. Paul area in Minnesota. And I probably would have told you when I was leaving college and in my first three years in that career helping sighted people get into printing jobs and machining jobs and mechanics and warehouse operations and all those positions that that’s not what people who are blind would have wanted to do or been capable of doing either.

And then I started with National Industries for the Blind and had a chance to visit these, you know, many of these 50-some agencies across the country that are producing and employing these 5,000 people who are blind. And I met machinists who are blind and mechanics and warehouse staff using technology and their skills and their education and their just gumption and getting it done.

And so even as a person who is blind, this program has opened my eyes to the capabilities of people who are blind. And I appreciate every day the work that our teams do to find new and innovative ways to create employment for people who are blind. And Mr. Congressman, Ms. Congressman, we are capable and we will get it done for our men and women in uniform.

Hoby: And I think in many ways we have to work harder than our sighted counterparts, and we might be even more capable of getting it done because our unemployment rate hovers right around 70%, and any job that we have that provides us with gainful employment, we’re going to take very seriously.

Danny: Well, and I think that’s why our program is so important, because it’s not just discrimination or people saying, “Oh, I don’t think people who are blind can do it.” People go blind later in life due to diabetes or an accident or whatever it might be, and they don’t even know what their capabilities are.

Hoby: Bingo.

Danny: And so almost 40% of my workforce, this is the first job they’ve ever had or the first job they’ve ever had as a person who is blind. And they will find their own path as long as we are here providing the platform that gets them back started rebuilding that confidence to have a job, have a career, support their families, and they’ll take it as far as they want to take it.

Hoby: I love that. I love that. And disability is the one part of minority that any of us can join at any time.

Danny: Yeah, that’s true.

Hoby: You know, so just embrace it. Embrace what’s out there. And if people want these opportunities and they’re good at what they do, let’s give them to them.

Danny: Yeah, know that we’re here to help.

Hoby: Yeah.

Danny: We’ll give you your start, and you make it a career.

Hoby: I know many people who listen to this episode are going to be totally inspired by you, Danny, just like I have been. What’s the best way for folks to get a hold of you?

Danny: I’m down at IFB Solutions in Winston-Salem. The website is www.ifbsolutions.org. I’m an open book. I’ll be as responsive as I can. You can find me on LinkedIn or my email address is dkelly, D-K-E-L-L-Y, @ifbsolutions.org.

Hoby: Perfect. Danny, it’s been an absolute pleasure. I can’t wait to spend some time with you on the Hill later this week.

Danny: Glad to be a part of the podcast. Thanks so much.

Hoby: Thanks so much, we’re honored to have you. We’ll have you back on again sometime.

Danny: I appreciate it. Cheers.

Hoby: Thank you, cheers.

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